Grantastic Designs’ Blog

Here’s a quote from Matt Bailey, President of Site Logic Marketing and speaker at the Search Engine Strategies San Jose conference on the panel, “Usability and SEO – Two Wins for the Price of One:”

“Search and usability are so intertwined… In my opinion, I believe that search engine optimization is really a child of usability and information architecture, because [SEO] is really doing the things that people in those [usability] industries have been saying for years.”

“Search really took off on it’s own, because people started figuring out that if you put keywords in the right places, you’ll start ranking. So Search got a lot of attention really fast. But its things that information architecture people and usability people had already been saying and doing for years.”

Last week, much of the technology media covered Google’s announcement of its anti-piracy filter for its YouTube site, a means of removing unauthorized copyrighted video clips. This proactive technology implementation appeared to have been spurred by the media giant Viacom suing Google for not previously taking proactive steps with the wide proliferation of its copyrighted video content appearing on YouTube.

Previously, YouTube already had manual copyright infringement notification guide for users to fill and and submit. Now, YouTube has also included a content verification program for reporting copyright infringement of multiple videos, or those expecting to have an ongoing need to remove potentially infringing content from YouTube).

My question to YouTube: how could this potentially affect video publishers using 3rd party content for “fair use” purposes? Could the filter make a distinction, or was video content to be automatically removed without first verifying the context of its use?

To that, I received the following statement from YouTube’s Director of Engineering, Jeremy Doig:

“We appreciate ideas from the various media companies on effective content identification technologies. We’re glad that they recognize the need to cooperate on these issues, and we’ll keep working with them to refine our industry-leading tools.”

OK, not exactly a direct response to my question. So I then did a follow up phone call with a YouTube spokesperson, who was very helpful with his explanation. How it works is like this: If you were to upload, as a 3rd party, some potentially infringing video content, you would receive a notification that your video content matched the original copyright owner’s in their database. You would then have the option of giving a counter-notification if you felt your content fell under fair use (or some other legitimate means, such as being an authorized provider). So just because the YouTube anti piracy filter might “ping” your content would not cause an automatic removal of said content.

YouTube’s spokesperson added that the anti-piracy actually isn’t in place just yet, and that their press release was just meant as an open-invitation for others to start signing up for the program. Right now, its simply a beta launch for YouTube to get their video catalogs and libraries up to date, and for them to recruit more companies than what they have for now.

In addition, YouTube’s spokesperon also mentioned that lot of media publishers are actually looking to use the technology just as a means of tracking their content online for advertising purposes (i.e., matching the video content with AdSense, overlay ads, or other ad opportunities ). According to YouTube’s spokesperson, many media publishers have said that they’re alright with leaving the content up there, since content owner has the option not just to block the content, but to leave it up there and monetize it through advertising.)

So if the anti-piracy filter work for YouTube as planned, 3rd party video content “posters” in YouTube that apply fair use practices to original copyright owner’s video should not have to be concerned with removal of such content.

So with that information, I guess my own video of Viacom’s Daily Show footage should stay up there after all. (I’m glad the thousand-plus viewers can appreciate it.)

A “news story” that has been repeatedly featured on Comedy Central’s “The Daily Show” including an updated piece last night, has host John Stewart reporting that U.S. Vice President Richard Cheney had Google remove his private residence (at the Naval Observatory on Massachusetts Avenue of the D.C. capital) from their Google Earth maps.

At the recent SMX Local Mobile Conference this month, I had already asked Michael Jones, Chief Technologist for Google Earth, Google Maps, and Google Local, about the story that’s been circulating on the internet that Comedy Central picked up as “fact.” Any truth to it?

“There’s absolutely no truth to the Cheney thing. Its surreal.” Says Michael.

So the fake news gets its own fake news wrong. Then again, should we really have any expectations for fake news? Or is that the easy excuse to fall back on when the satire loses it teeth? What I think will be especially ironic is if Comedy Central’s parent company, Viacom, has my YouTube video clip removed on grounds of copyright infringement. (Here’s my advance response in case that does happen: “So what, Lie-a-com, somehow its alright for you to have the Daily Show steal clips from everyone else and call it satire, but its not alright for me or others to exercise the same fair use of your clips to report REAL news?”)

At the end of the Search Marketing Expo Local Mobile keynote on October 1, Google Chief Technologist of Google Local, Google Maps, and Google Earth – Michael Jones demonstrated a bunch of 3-dimensional and panoramic models of how Google maps has worked with the masses of user generated content to create new “worlds” from a hyper-local scale to global scale. Michael expanded further by showing slides of how content could be mapped on a galactic scale:

“Everywhere its black there in the stars, you’ll have the hubble telescope focus in on that area, and you can actually see 50,000 galaxies in that area.” Mike said. “These galaxies have billions of stars in them. Maybe one of them has people that do search engine optimization.” That provoked some laughter from the crowd.

What made Michael’s keynote particularly enjoyable was his last slide, which showed a clip from the televsions cartoon series “The Simpsons.” The clip showed Marge Simpson on their home computer, doing a search for her house on Google Earth, and turning up an amusing result – Marge zooms in to her house and finds her husband Homer in the back yard, sunbathing nude.

Now the example wasn’t meant to be realistic, as what it was really simulating was live video via satellite. (I guess in the animated world of the Simpsons they have more advanced technology than ours, as well as less privacy.) It was also a bummer to find out that the video no longer exists online, since it was removed from YouTube after a copyright infringement claim was filed by 20th Century Fox Films. (I wonder if Google could have demanded that Fox Films remove the clip of Google Maps from the Simpsons episode in retaliation?)

I guess Fox Films doesn’t have a legal team versed in Spanish, or at least Google sites other than YouTube, because you can still catch the video here as well as other Spanish-language websites (Ha ha, take that, evil corporate behmoth!)

I actually remembered the original Simpson cartoon clip, and right then it made me think: Couldn’t Google also include in their online map inventory, the many “virtual worlds” that have large fan bases and user bases, both of past and present creations of literature, gaming, and community, along with internet-based worlds? Here are just a couple of examples that spring to my mind:

• Second Life. Its an active, ever-growing internet-based virtual world in 3-D, but with real-time residents.
• The Simpsons town of Springfield. The official Simpsons Movie website disappoints with a “tour Springfield” slideshow of town landmarks. Why not make this a panoramic map with real context and landmarks for every point, including the Simpsons’ own house?

The ideal Google Map – Matching the virtual world with the real world

Interestingly enough, the ideal virtual mapping scenario doesn’t come from Google Maps, but from video game platforms. Take the Microsoft Xbox 360 game, Test Drive Unlimited. Ttransforms the open roads of Hawaii into a gaming lobby, where you can pass by potential opponents on the road. You can virtually “drive” through every road on Oahu as it exists. Imagine if Google could work with 3-D modelers in every town in every city in every state, and do a virtual 3-D animation interconnecting them all – sort of a 21st century version of the 19th century railroad?

At the SMX Local Mobile Keynote on October 1, Michael Jones, Chief Technologist for Google Maps, Earth, and Local Search, talked about the comparisons and contrasts between online local search and the concierge business.

Concierges have been a professional society since 1929 in Europe, and since the late 1970s in the U.S.

“There are some parallels between what a concierge might do and what computers could do.” Michael said, describing the qualities of a good concierge and how local search attempts to parallel that criteria (shown in the slide below in parenthesis).

Advantages of a professional concierge over Google’s Local search

While more seasoned travelers and users overall are flocking to local search for tips, Michael admits that Google is not nearly as good as the service a hotel’s professional concierge could provide.

“As an industry, both from the provider side, from the user-satisfaction side, and from the optimization side, we’re weak in a lot of these areas.” said Michael. By comparison to professional concierges, Michael characterizes the current state of local search along personalization and customization as “pretty poor.”

Human concierges get a feel for what you mean, over what a computer interface can only do minimally with spelling.

Some of those advantage of good concierges I would add of my own:

• They have good connections. A good concierge can make quality reservations on short notice.
• They have special tips and deals with other businesses – that can include unique restaurants, shops, attractions and events.
• They can create memorable total-trip experiences (not just individual components thrown together) that can instill brand loyalty, making guests want to return to the hotel or recommend it to others.Good concierges have connections
• They can fill areas that have a lack of user-generated content online.
• They can provide honest expertise over the noise of the online crowd. There have been many cases online of competitors giving false “bad reviews” to each other. (This is especially prevalent among the top Chicago restaurants, so I’ve found.) A concierge can provide much better reliability when the noise of user-generated content reviews gets to be too much, especially when its overidden with bad spam reviews.

This would make the arguement that local search isn’t always a proper substitute over a concieges’ own expertise and long-term industry experience, and “human empathy.” (Human empathy would be extremely difficult for a computer even with artificial intelligence to properly duplicate.) Concierges are trained at hospitality management schools, and know how to handle guests needs on an emotional level. The concierge can get something contextual and semantical with the request – and that goes well beyond what the digital keyboard can provide.

“As an industry, both from the provider side, from the user-satisfaction side, and from the optimization side, we’re weak in a lot of these areas.” concedes Michael.

The state of the concierge industry

Concidentally, the day after Michael’s keynote presentation, USA Today ran a front-page story on the concierge industry. Interviews with hospitality service experts suggested that the need for concierges is decreasing with the growth of local search.

Except at upscale hotels, the concierge “is going the way of the elevator operator,” says Chekitan Dev, a Cornell University hotel school professor. “Owners and operators of midmarket and down-market hotels can no longer justify offering the service of a concierge,” he says, because plenty of information is available on the Internet, and “good concierges are hard to find, hard to keep and expensive.”

David Cranage, a professor at Penn State’s hospitality management school, suggests that hotels’ new moves to deliver information without a concierge staff may be akin to banks, a quarter-century ago, adding ATMs and, in some cases, discouraging the use of tellers by charging fees.

However, the story’s author said that “Whether sophisticated information technology could ultimately lead to the demise of the traditional concierge position is a matter of some disagreement in the hospitality industry. Neither the government nor the industry tracks employment numbers.”

What does seem clear is that even if concierges are being better trained to utilize online local search, a quality concierge, or just any concierge, appears to be reserved more for your high-end brand of hotels (in the 4-star and 5-star range). Other hotels rely on guest services, which often has no ample experience with local search. (When I contacted my local Holiday Inn on a Sunday, they mentioned that their sales department handles guest’s local travel tips, which was only available on weekdays!)

My recommendation for all hotels: mandatory local search training

In this where more travelers are using local search as part of their trip plans, every hotel, no matter what the size or rate, should make local search accessible to their guests – either with a concierge or staff member who has at least basic training in local search, along with easy access for guest themselves to online local search. This can be done by the following means:

• Including online local search in hospitality training.
• Provide assistance for travelers on how to enter local information into their cell phones via SMS, including placing the hotel address.
• Include a virtual concierge system – online services that give guests 24-hour access to information normally provided by a concierge. This can appear right when people access the wifi of the hotel, and right on the desktop computers available to guests.
• Feature staff picks based on employees’ knowledge of the area. As the USA Today article reports, this is already being done by 20% of the Radisson hotels in their American chain.
• Poll guests on their experiences, and have their own “hyper local” reviews by their guests, right on their hotel website. (These reviews could also be accessible  when people at the hotel login everytime to wifi.)

There have been times when I’ve actually found myself assisting concierges on how to find certain locations, and the information they have to offer.

While I don’t forsee the demise of concierges anytime soon, whether a hotel or building has a concierge or guest services staff of any kind, they all need be better trained on local search.  Local search may not necessarily “kill” the concierge business, but the concierge business needs to have better familiarity with online local search if they are to maintain their own relevance.

Special report from The Search Marketing Expo Keynote at the Denver Tech Center held October 1st, 2007.

Michael Jones, Chief Technologist for Google Maps, Earth, and Local Search, opened his keynote by explaining that his job is to make sure that we have the “right products in the future” – how they anticipate what those will be, and putting the technology and context together to achieve them. Rather than talking about the “how” of local search, Michael’s focus was on the direction of local seach – the “what” and the “why.” I.e., is local search dealing with the right problem to solve, and is Google going about the right way to solve it?

The weaknesses of today’s local search

“As an industry, both from the provider side, from the user-satisfaction side, and from the optimization side, we’re weak in a lot of these areas.” said Michael. “The ‘local’ search businesses of many companies aren’t really web-based, and a lot of them aren’t really web-savvy, either. A lot of them couldn’t even use a web map.”

Defining “local data” for local search

Michael said what’s changing is the idea of what is local data. “Local searching is clearly searching through local data. But what is local data?” Historically, what was local data wasn’t what was on a web page.

Michel defined local data as everything with a location. “Its not really about maps. Its about all the information we can organize, but in a context to truly understand it.” he said. “When you draw a map, its not about the map itself, but the map as context, to make information more useful. Its our view that all the information that’s on a web page could be better understood when placed on a map.”

Putting local data “in context”

Local search and data also needs a sense of place. This is where the contextual side comes in. And the experts bringing in this kind of local data are becoming the mass of uses, the “crowd.” One example Michael gave on this was the social networking site Yelp!, which has a very high group of people interested in sharing their experiences. “it’s like flirting through shared information.” says Michael.

Another good example of specialized local data in context is Google’s Local Transit map. Not only does it show bus routes, but it follows a mapping context more in tune with the needs of the users. Rather than mapping out the shortest distance from point A to point B, it shows the shortest time it will take to get there. “People care very much for having a context to support their information.” says Michael. “”When you put all of the pictures together in context, it becomes more understandable.”

“Some local information is all about place. Some are all about a factoid. Most of the world’s information can actually go on either one. The reason why the web is so valuable and played such a transformative role is because its not isolated information.”

“The combination of global and local, the broad and the contextual, with the granulation of personal elements, “is one of the magic things about web searching, local searching, and mapping.”

The future of Google Maps, Google Earth, and Local Search

Michael explained that the next challenge for local search to solve is connecting global things to the actual query, which he referred to as “Mapping the last mile.” Through the Google Earth program of allowing for popular content feeds and community generated content, along panoramic 3-d models, Michael said we can expect to see more of the following:

• More photographic maps in web browsers. “You could be able to see the photo in the front of a store restaurant advertising what the special of the day is.”
• More transactional features. (Where you can click on a placemark and make a transaction.)
• Real-time traffic.
• Geo-blogging by users – of all the places you’ve traveled to, and who you’ve met.
• Humanitarian causes. Several active examples are the US. Holocaust Memorial Museum, both with Jewish Holocaust of WWII, and today with “Learning about Darfur,” creating what is being called a “community of conscience.”

Google Maps –  genocide in Darfur

Michael ended his keynote by showing how Google Maps is partnering with using contributed content for extremely important humanitarian causes, that can help with worldwide education that gets people involved for social justice. The Darfur project zoom in on satellite images of the hardest hit villages and schools, but also puts the stories fo survivors in a deeply personal context.

“What the Wall Street Journal couldn’t tell you is that if you fly directly to a refugee camp, that’s where the UN Peacekeepers go into and talk to people about their history and experience” with the ongoing genocide in Darfur. “These are stories told by survivors, geo-located at the house where they or their loved ones were killed.” says Michael.

“Maps can bring a personal and emotional context, and can get people involved. It puts genocide on a level of personal engagement.” It becomes an affecting experience. Its not just a news story. This kind of connection of people at great length. People who didn’t once know where these places are, they do care now. I think the web and local information actually do have an influence on societies, now.” adds Michael.

To note, U.S. President George Bush has praised the Google Maps program and activity with the Darfur project. “No one who sees these pictures can doubt that genocide is the only word for what is happening in Darfur – and that we have a moral obligation to stop it.” (U.S. President George Bush, April 18, 2007)

At the SMX Local-Mobile keynote session on Oct 1st, I sat right in the front row, with co-hosts Greg Sterling and Chris Sherman alongside of me at the same table. Greg had turned his head my way and said, “I’m really looking forward to what you’ll have to say!”

I replied, confused, “what I have to say?”

To which Greg responded, “Oh no, I mean him.”

I looked to my immediately left, and that “him” he was referring to was Michael Jones, Chief Technologist for Google Maps, Google Earth, and Google Local, and the keynote speaker for the event. I had been talking with Michael minutes beforehand and he was oogling my super-small digital camcorder (a Sony Xacti VPC-CG65) I brought just for the purpose of testing out in the session. Kind of amusing that I wasn’t more aware of who the speaker was, but hey, he was a fill-in for the originally scheduled speaker. (According to Greg, IAC’s Peter Horan was slated to be the keynote but he had a family issue and had to withdraw.) It would be unfair to characterize Michael as a “replacement” because he was an excellent top draw, and seemed perfectly suited for the conference them. He even pulled double-daty and sat in on one of the other panels of the conference.

And I think Greg was still interested in what I had to say, anway.

Sorry to any of the blog readers here for the delay in posts. I’ve returned from the Search Engine Expo Local Mobile Expo in at the Denver Tech Center Oct 1-2nd, and gathered some exclusive coverage of the events. I’ll be posting news, interviews and commentary on the local search marketing sessions and panelists, and hopefully some podcast clips for a nice audio touch. Hopefully that can be forgiven for me not being a super-speedy blogger, as I sometimes like to take a couple days and clear my head, so I can put just a bit more thought into what I write than a bunch of scribbled notes. (Perhaps that makes me an SMX Slo-Mo blogger.)

It was a bit of an ordeal just arriving to the conference. Had my flight booked on United (you think I’d know better after having delays the past 4 flights), and had to wait nearly 3 hours past the scheduled departure time. It was evident that the collective waiting people have had to endure have put them more on edge every time they have a flight delay or cancellation with United. What I found slightly amusing was a man swearing out loud and walking off after the attendant at the gate couldn’t help him, and she announced over the microphone that “We have the right to arrest anyone who uses profanity at an employee.” To which, one ticket holder said sarcastically, “How about we just praise you loudly?!” And another ticket holder feigned, “Yeah, you’re doing a GREAT job!” This was followed by several more people clapping in mock approval.

Arriving to my first SMX conference was a treat. After being at several search marketing conference of thousands of attendants for 4-5 sessions going on at the same time, this had a more refined and seasoned group of left-and-right brain individuals both as panelists and audience members, much to my satisfaction and enjoyment. Smart move to have two “verticals” (or whatever the categorical term used that means anything about search categories these days), where there would be some overlap between sessions with the local and mobile space, but also making some clear distinctions in what track would best suit your needs. I was definite for the local track, since that has been more refined as a business model for most search marketers, and especially the common business (small-to-medium size enterprises, or SMEs).

My next post will include comments on Keynote speaker Michael Jones, Chief Technologist for Google Earth, Google Maps, and Google Local Search. The guy was sitting next to me at the keynote event and I didn’t even recognize him until he was announced by the event hosts!)

Michael T. Jones, Chief Technologist, Google Earth, Google Maps, and Google Local Search,

I will be attending and covering the upcoming Search Marketing Expo (SMX) Local & Mobile conference, being held in Denver this coming Monday and Tuesday, October 1st and 2nd. Some excellent preliminary information on the event and particular sessions is already available in podcast format by the event hosts. The following is an interview I recently conducted with Greg Sterling, founding principal of Sterling Market Intelligence, and co-host of the conference.

Why do local and mobile search lend themselves together?

Local and mobile are individually distinct categories, and we can speak about them both from the consumer side and the search marketing (advertising/organic) side, but there is also a high degree overlap between them. In mobile, the content categories that most people are interested in are local – maps and businesses, directory information, travel, etc. Local is a high use category in mobile; which make sense from the standpoint that people are on the go, they want to find out how to get from here to there, where a restaurant is, etc.

Local naturally lends itself very well to the SMBs (small-to-medium size businesses). But not so much for the mobile space. Has that changed?

I don’t think mobile is ready for small businesses yet. Mobile is not something that small businesses are every going to do on their own. The few exceptions are the small businesses that aggressively do search marketing may ultimately find acceptable ways to do mobile marketing. But what’s likely to happen in mobile is that the sales channel, the aggregators, the folks that currently work with small businesses on a large scale (e.g., IYPs and web hosting companies that offer marketing services) are going to push that data, those listings and ads, out into mobile. So you’ll have a distribution in mobile without even much awareness on the part of small businesses.

Here are two examples of that: one, is what Google is doing with AdWords, where mobile marketing is going to be an “opt out” starting November 19. They’re going to take most of the adwords which meet the criteria that they’ve laid out and push them into mobile search. So by buying into Adwords, you’re also going to get mobile distribution across Google Mobile Search. That may not be optimal for everyone and there are separate mobile SEO rules and things like that, but it’s really removing some of the friction that would be involved with setting up mobile as a separate product, queue or campaign.

On a specifically small business note: SuperPages.com is using the 1-800-[___]-3411 phone listing as one of its mobile distribution strategies for advertising clients. They have a pay-per-call product which they call “pay-for-call”, which they currently have about 5,000 advertisers which they’re sending into the 1-800-[___]-3411 system for mobile distribution. Again, that’s not a separate buy, nor is it something that the advertiser has to be involved with. They simply set up the campaign on SuperPages, and SuperPages takes care of that mobile distribution. I really think that’s going to be the model, or the means by which most small businesses get into mobile.

Also, you’ll see organic listings come up in mobile searches. Businesses adding their enhanced listings to Yahoo! Local, Google Maps, some of the IYP sites – those will all get mobile distribution as well.

Now, when talking specifically about the local desktop search space, that’s a more complicated matter. A lot of small businesses are now aware of the consumer behavior of audiences migrating online, and the Internet as the dominant tool for business hookups. But it’s still quite complicated for them to figure out what to do. They know the big search brands and some internet yellow pages (IYPs), but the majority of small businesses are still generally unaware of the “how” – how to get online distribution.

So what’s happing is small businesses are being sold Internet marketing by existing sales channels – web hosting companies, newspapers, yellow pages sites, etc. – are all pushing web marketing as part of a package of clicks, or clicks-to-calls, in a simplified way to the local small business. More and more small businesses are buying that, especially since most small businesses aren’t tech-savvy, and don’t have the time or personnel to really engage in that learning curve. So they’re relying on 3rd parties to make that simple – to buy search marketing, online marketing, search distribution – with simplified pricing and packaging – so they don’t have to do any of the campaign setup – keyword selection, distribution, etc. That’s all outsourced. Its usually sold on a flat-fee basis. Sometimes they’ll have packages with guaranteed clicks. The IYPs have been the single largest group of aggregating these advertisers. Over time you’ll have more and more self-provisioning that most of these small businesses, and the goal is to give these local businesses broader and broader distribution (on the desktop).

Mobile is a lot more complex for marketers to attempt to market and optimize to on their own, especially in comparison to desktop search. What are the variables that make this more complex?

There are different platforms in mobile, there’s voice search, there’s SMS or text messaging, there’s WAP (the mobile browser experience), and there’s rich clients that browsers are trying to push, because that often represents the best user experience. A good example of that would be Google Maps for mobile, or the Google mapping application on the iPhone. This immediately presents 4 different areas where you’ll find usage. Then, there’s the issue of all the devices, plus the various operating systems.

Right now, the bulk of mobile data usage is in text messaging, although there’s a substantial amount of people using WAP search to varying degrees. And there voice, which is the broadest segment of the market, because that’s how people have been accustomed to using mobile phones for directory listings.

You just need to have a very diversified strategy to reach the same user base that you might reach on the desktop. The desktop now has many more people, but over time, mobile will have a very high degree of usage. Especially when you consider the huge mobile phone penetration in the U.S. is much higher than computer penetration.

On your preview podcast, you alluded to the Community Local panel discussing some controversial topics. What will those be?

Paul Ryan, who is the CEO of a company called Done Right!, which is sort of a local-vertical site in home improvement space, has some contrary views about the local community in the local search experience. Obviously “community” is a well-established area online, but it can also get unwieldy. I think we’ll be getting into that paradox, where its very hard to get participation, but once you’ve got it, there can be a lot of noise and clutter that dimishes the user experience, in an ironic sort of way.

A good example of that would be TripAdvisor.com, which has a lot of great content, but can often be time-consuming and laborious to wade through. The debate could be over what if you’re TOO successful at getting outside participation and the negative effects. Does the excessive content compromise the user experience, and lead to diminishing returns at some point?

Another issue I can think of is “social exhaustion,” where there are already so many socio-local community sites to participate in and stay active in.

That’s another major issue. Just the clutter of all these sites sort of emulating each other, the functionality and labor of having to register and set up a profile on all of these different sites, does create a kind of fatigue.

Your podcast preview also mentions the Pay-Per-Call Ads session, where you said that mobile seems to be a much better model for this ad type than desktop search. Why do you think that’s the case?

There are two things responsible for this. One, there were high hopes for pay-per-call on the desktop Internet for distribution. But most of the high-traffic search sites, with the exception of AOL, have not chosen to adopt pay-per-call as a business model and make it an option for their advertisers. Most of the IYPs have also not done that, either. So you don’t have the distribution that might have been anticipated a couple of years ago.

However, in the mobile space, one of the primary ways people take action is by making a phone call. While that’s true on the desktop as well, on the desktop it’s a different behavior. With mobile, you’ve got a handset in your hand, literally. You’re looking for a local service and the primary way you’re going to achieve that is with a phone call. It’s a very natural fit between the pay-per-call business model and the user behavior there. You will see more penetration in the near-term of the pay-per-call model in mobile. In the long term, it may hold out the promise that was held initially on the desktop for more distribution.

You’re also having a debate panel. What are some of the debatable issues we can expect from that panel, or that you think are the biggest controversies today with local and mobile search?

I think one of the biggest controversies is, where’s the traffic going to be? Obviously on the Internet, search has been the starting point for so many different use cases, such as SEO and advertising for gaing traffic. Is that going to be true with local? Or, are Google, Yahoo!, MSN going to suck up all the traffic, and the other sites competing for organic search and SEM placements with local keywords, or will they be able to establish their own brands with strong destination traffic over time? That issue extends over into mobile, but mobile also includes the carriers. Are the carriers going to develop viable, widely used, consumer search tools? Or, are they simply going to become what had happened to most of the ISPs online – delivering connectivity but little else, and not really a bona fide search provider?

Craig Smith, who used to work at SuperPages, argued that IYPs are sort of waning in popularity, and will simply be SEO vehicles for local businesses over time, with not much consumer loyalty. That’s a debatable point, and people will have differing views on that.

One could also argue that because search has had such a profound impact with everyone on the Internet obviously, that search has become a brand-killer. Everybody just goes to search engines to find everything, and that dilutes the individual sites, loyalty and brand to some degree.

There also the issue with mobile, specifically, about the user experience. That’s something of a key factor that really has yet to be worked out. Most everyone is complaining that its still very hard to do search on a handset, that its awkward to use the keys or keyboard they provide with these phones. Questions arise, such as: where’s the usage going to be? Where’s the usage going to come from? What’s going to drive adoption, beyond the fact that there’s kind of a pent-up demand from consumers for mobile content on the go. Who is going to be able to innovate and create user experiences – perhaps like the iPhone or Google411 – that are going to be able to capture people’s imaginations in a way that desktop search has, and build audiences? That’s a story in-the-making, that has yet to be definitively determined.

Overall, mobile today is very much like the late 1990s of the Internet. There’s a lot of anticipation and hype, and you can see the usage starting to come, but many things are undetermined.

Outside of the U.S., mobile appears to be growing faster, or has already achieved some of these goals you described. What do you think will need to be the catalysts for the simpler-and-faster adoption rule for mobile search in the U.S.? Is it technology, legislation, consumer demand, all of the above, or other things?

There are layers of issues that you just suggested. Some of them are regulatory and legislative. For example, in the U.S., you really are at the mercy of carrier selection with the devices. The iPhone is the most acute example (with AT&T being the only carrier option). A lot of people want to get the iPhone, but don’t want to switch carriers. All the frenzy over a hacker unlocking the iPhone (and making it open to other carriers), indicates that consumers would like to have whatever phone they choose work with whatever carrier they have, but the structure of the U.S. market doesn’t permit that right now. Google is making a big push to do this, but we may not see any opening soon with the structure of the U.S. market in the way that I suggested.

But more important than that really, is with the audience of search, and the genius of search. Search involves a single box where you type in a query that represents an intention and get a response – either an advertiser or organic link – which in most cases, is going to give you more information or lead you to a transaction. Its just very, very simple and elegant (on the front end) in that regard. That’s what needs to happen with mobile. You have to be able to query the database in some form, either with voice, or text, or a desktop-like keyword entry of a term or terms, and get a response that essentially fulfills your need or expectation.

The situation is, you can’t exactly translate the desktop search into the mobile environment. We cover that issue in our Mobile Search: Beyond 10 Blue Links panel. The idea of simply presenting links to people in a mobile environment, given the small screen size on a mobile phone, the challenge of going back and forth between results data and an individual site, especially since most sites are not yet rendered for mobile display; it creates a lot of frustration and most people aren’t going to do it.

Yahoo! is trying to make the mobile search experience more suitable, by creating an application that’s much more intuitive and gives people answers, rather than links. Everybody is using that language now, to describe their own efforts in mobile. Its just has to be very, very simple.

There’s some other interesting applications out there, that are not out of left field exactly, but represent a different use-case or paradigm. There’s some local-mobile social networking efforts going on, where users in a distributed network text questions to each other for responses – kind of like putting “Yahoo! Answers” for Q&A discussion in a mobile environment. Questions like, what’s a good bar in midtown Denver, or a good place to stay. Or, general questions, such as outcomes of sporting events, or trivia, or whatever. The idea of tapping into the collective wisdom in some distributed user base in a mobile environment, is a very intriguing alternative to “pure search”, that may have some traction. But whatever the innovation, they have to conceal the complexity, make it very, very simple and intuitive for the end user, and they have to take into account the limitations of the device in ways that nobody has to content with on the desktop.

I also think that there’s going to be some interesting integration between mobile and desktop applications. You’re starting to see it with search engines and portals, such as the idea of setting up an account and personalized list of content, social bookmaking styles, or personalized home pages that then translate into mobile. We’re starting to see some personalization make its way into mobile. AOL’s WAP site is focusing pretty heavy on personalization. I think that will gain some traction in mobile that hasn’t really happened on the desktop. Not withstanding the popularity of social bookmarking, Most people don’t do much personalization actively. Some of that will lend itself to scenarios where people can manage their social bookmarks and have it transfer to their mobile device.

How about performance tracking for mobile? Do you see mobile eventually, or even on a small level right now, as a means of also capturing analytics and effectively measuring campaign performance?

I think what’s going to emerge is that some percentage of distribution from a campaign will be in mobile. Its like what Google is doing cross-media – audio, television, print, etc. – and include those data in a single integrated, campaign dashboard. I agree its still early for the advertiser, and certainly early for the small advertiser (aside from participating in existing programs with major providers I mentioned), but the consumer interest is very high. Again, it’s the same scenario with the computer desktop in the late 1990s. You gained larger consumer audiences, and they were monetized very effectively, and the advertisers followed. It took the Internet 10 years for it to become a serious medium for advertisers with widespread monetization. For the mobile space, It’s going to be half that time, or maybe even just a few years. There’s already a high level of interest and anticipation, a lot of competition, and a lot more interest being driven by that competition. Marketing agencies such as DoubleClick are feeling compelled to develop and promote mobile marketing strategies and work with mobile networks. It’s a much more integrated phenomenon than search engine marketing on the desktop was, or is today.

Another post in SearchDay covering a big legal issue for search marketers, copyright infringement. This comes from my interview coverage of several attorneys from the Search Engine Strategies San Jose conference in August, on the panel, “Copyrights and Trademarks – What SEMs should know.” Especially important is information on how to file a DMCA take down notice.

Also included are tips from the legal counsel of a couple major search engines, Live.com (from MSN) and Ask.